Thinking about doing it for the first time..

[bigpun81]

Hi guys, I've been over at EF doing research. I am definately thinking about doing some gear. Well I have decided to do some gear and am just awaiting time is right and I am prepared with everything I will need. So far these are the ingredients for my first ever cycle -

10 amps of Test E - Iran kind says 333 but its 250 I think
50 tabs of .25 Arimidex
100 tabs of 10mg Novladex
100 tabs of 50mg Clomid

I was skeptical about using dianabol and 500mg of test in this cycle because I didnt want to bloat up because I am kind of skinny but the more I think about it the more I am regretting not getting the dianabol since I went with a lower dose of test and I do have some adex. I still might "try" and get some dbol depending on certain variables but anyways what do you think of this cycle. I have been taking taking weight gainer and creatine and multivitamins and gakic. Should I continue taking creatine during cycle? Is this Iran gear higher mg like it says? Should I start the arimidex at the beginning of the cycle or wait till the end? I might just get some liquidex if I have to because I don't think 50 tabs is going to last the 10 wks I plan on doing this. Okay here at my STATS -

6'0 - 160 lbs - bodyfat ??? 15% maybe less or more I really don't know - I am 24 years old now. I started training when I went to prison at 20 years old. Took some time off training and have been back into for the last 2 months. Hopefully will be 165-170 before i start this cycle. I am probably taking in about 4000 calories a day with my weight gainer and my goal eventually is to be about 200-220 lbs of lean muscle. my goal for this cycle is about 20 lbs of muscle.

[Mr.X]

At 160lbs., you have a long way to go before you do a cycle.

What's your diet like? post it please.

[djsf]

There are two topics together here, one is whether or not you are a good candidate for using steroids, and the other is about designing your cycle.

My personal belief is it takes a lot of discipline to use steroids wisely, to run your cycle without deviating from it and to stay off when you have planned to be off recovering. You will love the feeling of the steroids and it's easy to get hooked on that. When you come off you will probably feel like you want to go back on. Not going off completely or staying on too much of the time will screw with your hormone system and potentially cause long term health problems, long term loss of libido, and with some people, depression.

Pun, are you willing to cycle with discipline and let yourself fully recover during the time you committed for that? This question is hardest to answer right around the time you are finishing your cycle.

You are pretty much an average sized guy at 6' 160 lbs. Are you ready for what is going to happen to you when you muscle up? You are likely to gain 15+ lbs on this cycle if you work out hard and eat right. If you continue to cycle you could easily end up at 220+ lbs at your height, in the next year. Can you handle the effects such dramatic change in your body will bring to you? Friends, family, work, etc.

I am also of the belief one should only consider using steroids once you have gotten to a point where you have built a solid foundation and reached your body's limits and can no longer gain by hard workout and diet alone. I worked out for 23 years before getting there (for me that point was 200lbs at 6'2"). Before I started AAS I was already committed to working out for life and already had a strong, muscular body. I had put on 45 lbs of muscle by working out naturally but 200lbs proved to be my natural limit after 23 years of trying without AAS. Then I decided to start. I was 40 years old.

In my opinion, at 24 and 6' 160, you are a bit young and you are nowhere near your own potential yet, and you have probably not yet built your body to its natural limits yet. Not to mention, at 24, your youthful body should still be producing high levels of natural testosterone on its own. Enough to let you build a very muscular body if you work out hard and eat properly.

A final consideration is that steroids are illegal in most places and carry heavy penalties for possession if caught. Are you prepared for this?

Obviously it's your choice whether or not to use AAS, and more than likely, you have already made your choice. Please consider these points and reply with your thoughts.

[djsf]

With the materials you have on hand, there are a few ways you can cycle. Here is one proposal for a 7 week cycle with PCT:

Week 1-7: 333mg enant every 5 days (that works out to 466mg/week)
Week 1-7: .25mg arimidex ed (.5mg ed would be better, you can supplement with .25mg ed liquiDex)

Pre-PCT and PCT
Week 8-9: Off. Take 10mg liquiAromasin or .5mg liquiDex ed
Week 9: Using 5000iu of HCG, take 1000iu eod for 5 shots (10 days)
Week 9-13: 20mg ed nolvadex
Week 10-12: 300mg clomid the first day only, 100mg clomid ed for 10 more days, then 50mg ed for 10 more days (21 days total)
Week 10-13: 10mg liquiAromasin, tapering off to zero in week 13

Do do your PCT, you're going to have to get a few more things:
HCG 5,000iu
Some bateristatic water to mix with the HCG
at least on insulin pin or 27g pin with syringe
liquiAromasin and/or liquiDex (from www.ag-guys.com)
Have *everything* on hand before starting, including your PCT!

This is just one proposal, there are lots of ways you can do this. Some of the other bros here might have alternative ideas.

[bigpun81]

Djsf, thanks your response is greatly appreciated. I will definately think about doing this the way you proposed. I have a couple questions about it though.
You think it would be better for me to run a higher dose for a shorter time? What are the advantages of this? Should I definately use HCG even with the low dosage and clomid and novladex already lined up? What are the possible drawbacks if say I have another 20 lbs to go before I hit my genetic limit and I decide to cycle anyways. My dad was 6'2 180, with an atheletic build. My mom is like 5'3 110 lbs. So I could be pretty close to my genetic limit already. I want to do this right and your input is greatly appreciated. I just got back into training not long ago and have been making some noticable gains and most of my friends/family know is that I am working out. It would be kind of conveinant for me to do this cycle as soon as my gains slow down so I don't just blow up all of a sudden.

Mr X. - This is what my diet in a normal work day looks like
6:30 am - wake up, big bowl of cereal and a banana and mega men vitamins
9:30 am - work break - couple handfuls of peanuts
11:00 am - lunch - turkey grinder w/ lots of turkey, big slim jim, granola bar
2:00pm - some more peanuts - I have a huge can of them at work -
4pm - i go work out, take some cell-tech afterwards
6-7pm - dinner- 1/2 lb of chicken or beef - potatoes and veggies
9 or 10pm - snack on something - chips+salsa or something
12-1 am - 1 serving of GNC weight gainer 2200 gold - 3 egg whites - 1 cup of ice cream put in the blender.
Shortly after the Weight gainer I try to fall asleep.

I am going to try and refine this diet by eating a can of tuna on my work breaks and maybe another small type of meal after work/before gym. Also I would like to try and get to bed at an earlier time because 5-6 hrs of sleep kind of sucks and will hinder my gains. Any advice on this diet/cycle would be appreciated.
I read that test e doesnt usually kick in till week 3 so I think I would get more from the cycle by doing a lower dose for longer peroid of time. My original plan for the cycle was to this
wk 1-10 - 1 amp of Test E per week
wk 3-10 - .25 mg of Arimidex ED
PCT:
wk 11-12 - 150 mg of clomid ed, maybe 200 for the first day
wk 11-12 - 20 mg of novladex ed
wk 12-13 - 100 mg of clomid ed
wk 12-13 - 20 mg of novladex ed
wk 13-14 - 50 mg of clomid ed
wk 13-14 - 10 mg of novladex ed
Dunno if that is too much clomid or novla, you guys would know better than me.

[djsf]

Pun,
I do prefer to run shorter cycles, but I am often in the minority on this one. I believe short, strong cycles are more effective and are the easier to recover from. A higher dose of AAS will get you good results quickly (if you work out hard 5+ days a week and eat right), and a short cycle is a lot easier to recover from imo. I also feel after 8-10 weeks, side effects start to outweigh gains, which is why I like to keep cycles under 8 weeks and strong (and not do 12 or 16 week cycles).

You could certainly do this as a 14-week cycle:
Week 1-14: 1/2 of a 333mg amp of enant every 5 days (that works out to 233mg/week)
Week 1-14: .25mg arimidex eod (.25mg ed would be better, you can supplement with liquiDex)

You could also do a 9 week cycle:
Week 1-9: 1/2 of a 333mg amp of enant every 3 days (that works out to 387mg/week)
Week 1-9: .5mg arimidex ed, supplement your arimidex with liquiDex)

But I think with the weaker cycles you will be a little disappointed.

I would do a short / strong cycle with what you have. In the mean time, you should recover quickly and your time off can also be relatively short (time off = time on + PCT). You can use that time to locate materials for your next cycle.

If you really want to do a longer cycle, that is ok. Try it and see if you like it.