F*ck me....Romney quit

[Gator_Mclusky]

We all seem to think we know the truth. I wonder what the real truth is? It would be unbelievable to actually know the real answers to these questions.

[Ironmako]

Originally Posted by hanuri

funny thing Clinton was never thought as devil over here( haven´t heard that myself) . but this Bush Jr ....he has been called something nearly as bad as devil. it´s not just Bush family who has a grip on things . Saudi´s for one and others are queing..... BUT IMO the focus of history will see GW in a light this world might not be ready for. my humble word ( like it would mean something).
interesting times....

Bill Clinton wasn't screwing your country over like he was mine. Those of us over here who care about the policies he enacted and how they harmed the United States have a long memory, and don't plan on forgetting anytime soon.

[Ironmako]

Originally Posted by hanuri

for the record : our neighbour is way worse than US and Putin is much more evil B admin ever could. had to say this

I'll agree with you there. Putin is much more dangerous...once KGB always KGB

[Ironmako]

Originally Posted by hanuri

I shortened the quote a bit.... I don´t know how could I say this nicely. the news here are indeed guite unbiased . they just tell what happened and a bit of why perhaps . as speaking w regular people one thing comes out ; oil. not many I know believe in the official 911 story. 911 was something that came out too handily for B admin and paved the way to Iraq(oil) . ever heard of term "new Pearl Harbour"? to put it in two words ... money and oil were the reasons . war on terrorism was just a front. I´m talking about people I know . other wiews excists too.....

I've never seen any proof of how American companies profited off of Iraqi oil. I'm wondering if you've seen any evidence of this. I have not and would love to see it.

[Ironmako]

Personally if we don't get permanent bases in Iraq (no matter what the officials say) then it was a big waste of time, blood, lives, and money.

No American's life is worth "granting" freedom to any Iraqi. Freedom is earned and earned only. It can't be given out like welfare.

[Gator_Mclusky]

Originally Posted by Ironmako

Personally if we don't get permanent bases in Iraq (no matter what the officials say) then it was a big waste of time, blood, lives, and money.

No American's life is worth "granting" freedom to any Iraqi. Freedom is earned and earned only. It can't be given out like welfare.

Well put.....
There's no way we are leaving Iraq. We will turn over the security to the Iraqis for the most part but you know we will always be in command. We will have bases...permanent bases in Iraq and this will definitely help stabilize the country and region.
We will have a puppet govt of course as well.
(Reminds me of Jimmy Carter just handing over the Panama Canal that we built....we had to go back in and take that back and restore Democracy after Jimmy gave thef'n thing away!!!!!) Theres a big difference in a Maritime through fare and a country but its the same principle. Dems will tuck tail and hand it over to the Iraqis and we'll be worse off than when we started!!!

[hanuri]

Originally Posted by Ironmako

I've never seen any proof of how American companies profited off of Iraqi oil. I'm wondering if you've seen any evidence of this. I have not and would love to see it.

have you watched Micheal Moore´s Fahrenheit 911 ? war industry ....and finally the oil ( after some 50 yrs of effort prolly)

[hanuri]

Originally Posted by Ironmako

Bill Clinton wasn't screwing your country over like he was mine. Those of us over here who care about the policies he enacted and how they harmed the United States have a long memory, and don't plan on forgetting anytime soon.

not doubting you . You live there. How do people react to GWB and his two terms? how bout his policies ...... Patriot act and like? just curious

[Ironmako]

Originally Posted by hanuri

have you watched Micheal Moore´s Fahrenheit 911 ? war industry ....and finally the oil ( after some 50 yrs of effort prolly)

C'mon now, please be serious. Michael Moore is a propogandist with no credibility, and I don't consider movies as evidence.

Evidence has to be tangible and concrete, something that can independently verified.

[Ironmako]

Originally Posted by hanuri

not doubting you . You live there. How do people react to GWB and his two terms? how bout his policies ...... Patriot act and like? just curious

Patriot Act was a mixed bag...some parts of it are good, some parts are at least justifiable (even to those who seriously care about maintaining our liberties) and some parts just flat out cross the line.

Much like the main problem with congressional legislation, it would be nice if we could strike off the parts that are bullshit and keep the parts that are good.

GWB like I said earlier was a disappointment. There are many reasons for this and the regard that Bush is held in over here is a very nuanced issue. Many people are flat out angry with him.

The people on the left have criticisms but their criticisms in large part suffer from irrationality and are illogical. If some of their ideas are extrapolated to their endpoints the US as a nation and society would be unsustainable.

Then there are many on the right that feel flat out betrayed that he hasn't adhered to the conservative principles that the republicans used to be based on.

In environmental speak GWB is a hybrid. He is not a straight conservative, he will adopt certain liberal positions to "buy" votes just like the democrats have done for decades. So IMO he is tainted.

Then people are also frustrated b/c GWB hasn't accomplished much while in office. But on this count he had help. McCain made great efforts to thwart the republicans from doing any good work b/c he wanted revenge against GWB for beating him in the 2000 election, and didn't want GWB to get any credit for doing good work.

GWB was never the best choice for president...but...when we were faced with the even worse candidates from the left by comparison GWB was great.

That however was purely relative.

Sad thing is the choices we face now are even worse. The US is declining very rapidly.